Tapping&Cloning: Checking and Preventing?

  1. chinchilla

    chinchilla New Member

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    Ok, before I start with this, I would like to say I've pulled an all-nighter basically and have spent the last several hours researching into the following and have learned a lot (considering I knew hardly anything before I started) but still have found no direct or definite answer to my question (at least that are from the past year at least).[​IMG]

    I want to know if there is any way of finding out if my iPhone (3G 3.1.3FW) is tapped to where somebody could listen in or remotely do anything (besides Apple, obviously, or one of their 3rd parties).

    The short version of my story, because I feel the need to explain because I'm sure it all just sounds like a bunch of conspiracy crap that I should go build a tin foil hat for....BUT....it happens like this: I get pulled over by the police on a routine traffic stop and get arrested for a "DWI" (at 1:30pm in the afternoon, and I hardly ever drink, and hadn't done any drugs in almost a month). However, this routine traffic stop spins out of control for no reason, and they tear my car the F*CK apart, DESPERATE to find something (I live in a CROOKED MFN county). Anyway, long story short, I'm arrested and they take my iPhone from me after I'm handcuffed in the backseat of the squad car and say "we'll be in contact with you about it". Besides the worry of sensitive data on the phone that was probably seen in this illegal seizure which hopefully is deemed inadmissible in court, I'm worried if my phone has been tapped now that I got it back. :036:inthedark

    Someone told me "there's an app for that" but I've yet to find it. Someone told me it's illegal for them to tap without a warrant, but they can clone my phone without needing one. I spent a few hours looking into cloning, and have determined it a lost cause by any of my own means, but police technology is probably more advanced than me, however everyone says that it's impossible to extract the KI number from SIMS v2 and up, which seems to be necessary in the process of cloning. Apparently there is no way to check for cloning (unless you have an unusually large bill, which wouldn't apply in my case), but I'm just looking for confirmation.:dft005:frazzled

    In the past few hours I've found out that listening in through the microphone can be done without even a phone call being placed, and some claim to do so with the phone OFF. (flexispy, mobile spy, estealth, neo-call). And this isn't even talking about strictly government or police technology, but services to the general public to "monitor your texting teens!" or to "keep an eye on your cheating spouse!". Apparently there's no way to check for this either? S-Mobile apparently makes phone antivirus software, but the only one they have for iPhone just encrypts your contacts.

    Maybe I've answered all of my own questions, but I would at least just like confirmation (or hopefully a solution) in knowing if my phone is tapped or cloned. And what I might be able to do about it.

    Oh, also I called my local AT&T store and reported it stolen (because it was...for 2 months exactly), and luckily (I guess) I was able to buy a new iPhone for a discounted price. I wanted to keep my same phone number, not thinking ahead, and now I'm wondering that if in the possibility my old iPhone is tapped/cloned (and let's pretend it is, I don't need any ridicule) would my new iPhone be tapped/cloned also? Or would having a new IMEI throw it off? [​IMG]

    I feel like I have a lot of loose ends here, I'm desperate for help (google is usually sufficient enough). Any input is appreciated (as long as it isn't a repeat statement of something I've said :sneaky: ).
     
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  2. simba33

    simba33 New Member Silver

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    i'd just restore as a new phone in iTunes if your that worried. the only other way they can tap into your phone is hardware which means they took it apart, which is also illegal because that voids YOUR products warranty without your consent or a warrent. if they do tap your phone they need good evidence or a good lead that your doing something illegal. otherwise whatever they do find by tapping into your phone has to be voided in court because it wasn't a legal way to obtain the evidence. just my thoughts

    edit** i am sorry didn't read the cloning part, ive never heard of cloning before so ill have to do some of my own research. your better off just going into AT&T and getting your number changed, i hear you can do it like once every 2-3 years or something like that so you might want to look into that. thats all the information I can give you (for now, until i research more) though im sorry.
     
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  4. psylichon

    psylichon Genius Moderator

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    When they tap a cell phone, from what I understand, it's done at the carrier level and they will need a warrant. I highly doubt anything was physically different with your phone when they handed it back to you.
     
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  5. simba33

    simba33 New Member Silver

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    that was partly my thoughts but im not totally sure, thats why i put just my thoughts at the end. i'm pretty darn sure psylichon is right, theyd have to be in contact with your carrier and have a warrent to do so.
     
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  6. Hawk

    Hawk Genius Gold

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    Here is a way to test if your phone is illegally tapped of cloned, especially if you have a court case coming up.
    Put your phone in a box under a pillow in a closet. Grab a friend with a Video camera, and first video tape the 2 of you together stating that you will be testing your phone for illegal tapping or cloning (do not say you believe the police are doing it). Then your friend is to man the camera and tape you retrieving your phone and testing it.
    Make sure that the phone's camera never faces your friend. Here is the first test: without making a call, have a conversation with your friend about weed or something and about who you can score some from. Call it "herb".
    Next make a phone call to a third person that should be in on this ( and documented) and without stating you are buying or even looking for "herb" talk about it and then agree to have that person either visit you or you visit them. Take your time with all of this. If someone is really listening, they will need time to organize.
    When you meet the third friend, "seal the deal" without stating it, and obtain some basil from him for your pasta dish.
    here are the scenarios that will follow:
    1) nothing happens....ever
    2) you are swarmed by PD - guard the tape or hide the camera for later retrieval.
    3) this gets brought up in court, in which case your lawyer can present your evidence and then make the accusation of illegal phone tapping and surveillance.

    After all is said and done, I think you will be fine, but you might consider relocation to avoid further harassment.


    As far as the ability to spy on you without the phone even being on? Yes there is software out there for that used by the Feds to spy on suspected terrorists, Mafia members, and other organized criminal elements. The software is highly illegal in most cases since it voilates many FCC regulations. It's very unlikely a local PD group would have access to it.
    In order to tap your line, they would have to work with AT&T to gain access. At that point, there is not a whole lot you can do because they would HAVE to have a warrant. AT&T does not (normally) allow that kind of access to a cell phone. (not unless the rep that gives them access without authorization is a complete moron)

    The end statement is most likely true: Your phone has not been tapped or is spying on you. If you really believe it is, then the only recourse is to test it out to see if it's true. Documentation is KEY on the off-chance someone is spying, so you can say you believe your phone was "hacked" and you testing to see if it was true, and that at no point and time was any illegal activity going on, though it might be misconstrued that way.
     
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  7. simba33

    simba33 New Member Silver

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    hawk your awsome, enough said
     
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  8. psylichon

    psylichon Genius Moderator

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    I think a standard disclaimer is warranted here... be wary when taking legal advice from an iPhone forum. That is all...
     
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  9. Hawk

    Hawk Genius Gold

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    No doubt! I am not a lawyer or have played one on TV. Nor did I stay at a Holiday Inn Express.
     
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  10. chinchilla

    chinchilla New Member

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    I think that's actually an awesome idea, I wish it were simpler, but you make a good point.

    I hope so, and believe me, relocation is something I've had wet dreams about for the past year, just been too poor unfortunately.

    Unfortunately, this is very untrue from what I learned late last night. Services from FlexiSpy and neo-call.com are available to the general public, you only need to be physically in contact with the phone for just a few minutes if you know what you're doing. Neo-call is the one that claims it can record while the phone is off, however FlexiSpy seems to be the more popular one that can let somebody listen in when say the phone is just in your pocket. HOWEVER, even though these programs supposedly run super-silently and there is not way of detection, I'm pretty sure a simple firmware restore fixes that problem.

    Thanks a bunch, Hawk, but I would also like to sincerely thank everybody else for their input, it's the overall combined replies as a whole that really help determine a good answer.
     
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  11. chinchilla

    chinchilla New Member

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    Actually, I still have part of a question unanswered: If phone(A) was cloned and then the SIM was deactivated by the carrier, would phone(b) that is activated under the same phone number allow the clone to work again? I'm pretty sure since the IMEI is different, it wouldn't work, but how hard would it be to find out the new IMEI (especially if you're a cop)?

    If I already got phone(b) activated under the same phone number as phone(A), would it still even be useful to change the number? Or would they be able to find the new IMEI since it's the same number, and a number change would show up just as easy?
     
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  12. Stupiderlikeafox

    Stupiderlikeafox New Member Bronze

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    Wow. Gave me a laugh this cold and snowy Monday morning in Blighty.

    Paul.
     
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  13. Apple4me

    Apple4me Zealot Gold

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    There is some crazy scary stuff posted in this thread. I don't even want to think about it :002:upset
     
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  14. Stupiderlikeafox

    Stupiderlikeafox New Member Bronze

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    Yup. Funny that weed got a mention.
     
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