Why aren't we allowed to complain?

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prmdbr

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Jul 29, 2007
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#1
I've been lurking this board since the release of the iPhone. There are some well informed and objective peeps here. I enjoy their posts and I think they enrich this forum.

There are however, others, mindless iPhone zea lots that make this place insufferable at times. These are the people that scorn any poster that has ANY adverse thing to say about the iPhone. I often see phrases like:

- ..why did you buy an iPhone, then?
- Apple doesn't have to please you.
- The iPhone is perfect, you're just looking for something to complain about.
- ..get over it.

... and sometimes just a terse, "Stop Complaining"

If I'm not mistaken, the name and aim of the forum is EVERYTHINGiPhone. That means the good AND the bad.

For those that wish to submit to idolotry and blindly worship the iPhone, then so, it is their prerogative. However, if someone is dissalusioned with the phone, its fit and features (or lack there of), they should be allowed to voice their pain without fear of being flamed by someone who probably hasn't even tried to understand the other person's point-of-view.

I have an iPhone, I pretty much hate it. Not because of any specific suckiness, but because I know in my heart that Apple won't nurture the power of the device, at least in the near term. What is left is a device that looks good, does a few things but ultimately holds no value for a poweruser.
 

rwily

New Member
Jul 12, 2007
10
0
0
#2
I've been lurking this board since the release of the iPhone. There are some well informed and objective peeps here. I enjoy their posts and I think they enrich this forum.

There are however, others, mindless iPhone zea lots that make this place insufferable at times. These are the people that scorn any poster that has ANY adverse thing to say about the iPhone. I often see phrases like:

- ..why did you buy an iPhone, then?
- Apple doesn't have to please you.
- The iPhone is perfect, you're just looking for something to complain about.

... and sometimes just a terse, "Stop Complaining"

If I'm not mistaken, the name and aim of the forum is EVERYTHINGiPhone. That means the good AND the bad.

For those that wish to submit to idolotry and blindly worship the iPhone, then so, it is their prerogative. However, if someone is dissalusioned with the phone, its fit and features (or lack there of), they should be allowed to voice their pain without fear of being flamed by someone who probably hasn't even tried to understand the other person's point-of-view.

I have an iPhone, I pretty much hate it. Not because of any specific suckiness, but because I know in my heart that Apple won't nurture the power of the device, at least in the near term. What is left is a device that looks good, does a few things but ultimately holds no value for a poweruser.
People are allowed to complain. And others are allowed to agree or disagree with them. I do agree with you that sometimes the level of disagreement goes overboard, however.

Also, I don't know why you would assume that Apple won't continue to develop and perfect the iPhone, which is already a pretty impressive device. Just look at what Apple has done with notebooks, iMacs and iPods. A very impressive record of evolution, I would say.
 

jpmihalk

Member
Bronze
May 16, 2007
253
3
18
USA
#3
I think one of the lesser-discussed topics is really how power users continue to be disappointed with the iPhone. It was never marketed as a power device, just a reliable all-in-one cell phone/web browser/media player. Sure, my Blackjack can do all of that and much more (and on a 3G network) but it doesn't do the things that it shares in common with the iPhone as well. And I don't have a need for those particular functions that would cause me to need a power device, but many others do. It's really more of a matter of people doing their homework before buying into the hype.

I'm sorry that you feel like the iPhone holds no value for you. Hopefully, there is a device out there for you that does.
 

The Apple

Zealot
Gold
Aug 2, 2007
3,105
0
38
Indiana
#4
the iPhone has just been out for a little over a month. Do you think Apple had intentions of releasing the phone and not trying to improvise it? Alot of people have been comparing it to phones that have been on the market for years complaining that it wasn't perfect right out of the box. I think this phone has the capability of being improved through software in the future a lot easier than its competitors. I'm not saying the phone is perfect, but it is the best first attempt from a cell phone manufacturer I have ever seen. Just imagine what this phone will be like in a couple years!
 

gijohn

New Member
Bronze
Jul 22, 2007
172
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0
66
#5
I have an iPhone, I pretty much hate it. Not because of any specific suckiness, but because I know in my heart that Apple won't nurture the power of the device, at least in the near term. What is left is a device that looks good, does a few things but ultimately holds no value for a poweruser.
Let me preface this with:
I still don't own an iPhone - I'm still procrastinating, but have been reading this forum, asking questions, etc for quite some time (a few weeks?)

I'm not trying to be "flip" or a smart alec .... but why did you buy an iPhone? How much did you know about what it could and could not do before your purchase? And when you bought it - did you at that time feel Apple would not "nurture the power of the device, at least in the near term"?

Thanks for your responses. They may help myself and others decide if the iPhone fits their needs.
 

Norwest

New Member
Bronze
Jul 23, 2007
133
0
0
#6
I have to agree with the OP. There are way too many iPhone fanboys who dismiss every gripe.

Look, I love my iPhone. Is it worth $600? Yes, to me it is. Is it missing some pretty basic stuff? Hell yes. I advise people to be patient and see what Apple has in store for early adopters over the next 2-3 months.

There are some glaring oversights that we all hope will get fixed. Mentioning those (or the frustraton with) should not subject the poster to ridicule.

The iPhone 'aint perfect. It's not even close to being the "best phone" yet despite all the claims of "The greatest phone in the world!" ... from iPhone fanboys. It's actual phone features once you get on a call are pretty darn good (ease of transferring/conferencing/holding etc)... but phones (smartphones) are judged by more than just the operation of the actual phone. As a total package it's not even close to some of the others... yet.

It's the expectation of what's to come that has people hanging on, and the great UI.

Let me just say this... when I take notes on the iPhone... I write them out by hand and then take a picture of them. That way at least they'll get transferred to my computer when I sync.

And no, I'm not gonna create a dummy contact everytime I want to add a note.

It is however .,.. the coolest phone in the world... :laugh2: ... not the best. Not yet.
 

Kabeyun

Member
Silver
Jan 10, 2007
665
0
16
Northeast US
#7
Let me first say that this is a good thread with constructive posts all 'round. I completely understand the OP's issue; no one with a legitimate complaint about the iPhone would want their point of view stifled in a forum designed for just such a discussion.

However, what you may have noticed (at least in part) is a reaction to an unfortunate phenomenon called trolling. Some people simply post to be contrary, obnoxious, or worse, to discredit the iPhone or these forums. In politics this is called muckraking. You may have noticed that EI.com has taken a sterner stand against trollers picking fights just for the sake of being negative. It's certainly a fine line to distinguish between someone trolling, and someone airing a legitimate grievance in hopes of generating discussion and possibly a solution. Registering just to bash the iPhone won't be tolerated, but raising issues, exchanging troubleshooting tips, and fantasizing about the next version's feature set versus the current version's shortcomings are most certainly encouraged.

Those "mindless zea lots" may (at least in part) be reacting to trolling in their own way. Having had their fill, some may be unfairly jumping on a post with something critical to say. This is also something we're working to rein in. Again, opinions on the iPhone vary and often passionately so.

We want EI.com to be a welcoming place, for veterans and newbies alike, to share information. However, the administration of this site reserves the right to make the final judgment on what constitutes trolling, as well as what constitutes an inappropriate response to a legitimate complaint. We can't be everywhere, so we count on responsible members such as yourselves to report when you feel something inappropriate is going on. Your gut will usually tell you, and if we agree action will be taken against trolls and flames alike.

Thanks again for contributing to EI.com. See you around!

-K
 
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gijohn

New Member
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Jul 22, 2007
172
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#8
Your choice of words and combination of same is - hmmmm, how should I put it .... exemplary. :)
 

rdmb57

New Member
Aug 4, 2007
13
0
0
#9
There are however, others, mindless iPhone zea lots that make this place insufferable at times. These are the people that scorn any poster that has ANY adverse thing to say about the iPhone.
Welcome to the concept of "fandom". It seems to be a more pronounced effect in the "techy/geek" communities surrounding technologies. You'll see the same effect in discussions about operating systems, peripheral devices (video cards, etc..) and to a lesser extent, in the automotive and motorcycling communities.

Marketing experts agree that once they have made the sale, the purchaser needs to feel that they indeed made a good decision to buy their product. This is why you'll see a lot of "reinforcement" type advertisments out there, primarily for automobiles. You see, when someone makes a large discretionary purchase, it is important for them to feel that they made a good decision.

Forums such as these are where like minded people (ostensibly have purchased an iPhone) can get together and compliment each other about how smart they were to make a decidedly luxury type purchase. $600 for a cellular phone (at it's roots) is equivalent of a person buying a Lexus or Benz in car parlance. With that much cash outlay, in discussions you can see from the threads here that any criticisms or complaints are generally swiftly discouraged. Think about it from a psychological standpoint - folks are probably catching grief as it is from their friends and family for buying a $600 phone. Even if some flaws are true (such as the inability to send MMS pictures through the device), to hear these flaws makes the person question their intelligence in purchasing the device.

Another effect seen in forums like this is pronounced obsessive tendencies. If a person is generally getting upset about say, a miniscule cosmetic defect on the iPhone, reality says that they are overreacting. Coming to a place like this and finding other like minded folks (who also obsess over minutia) calms their internal conflicts.

Forums such as this generally have much more "noise" than "signal", but through judicious searching and review you can generally find some helpful information between bloviating fanboys.

For me, I purchased my iPhone on "i-day" and while there are some surprises in functionality, for the most part I don't regret the purchase. But I take a more pragmatic approach - not obsessing over "is my screen a 5 or a 7" for instance. The poor folks at the Apple stores have got to be really getting a giggle out of the poor OCD laden purchasers searching for refunds and exchanges due to things like a 1/64th inch gap in the case that "is collecting some lint".

I saw the same effect when the PSP and iPod was released and once the bloom has worn off of the rose, traffic will slow down in this forum. But that minimzed traffic will have much more usable information.

Be patient - this too shall pass :)
 

vansouza

New Member
Bronze
Jul 11, 2007
164
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0
Las Vegas, NV USA
www.usheroes.us
#10
What's wrong with perfect...

And for some of us the iPhone is perfect... all we need and happy to wait for updates... that does not mean we should be dismissed as fanbots... so the knife cuts both ways... if the complaint seems like it is just chum for sharks, then some sharks attack. That's life pretty much, and if some come to the defense of the phone, they are just fanboys... that said ... I agree that at times the attack can be too quick and go too far. Sometimes posts seem to just be there to push the right buttons; I believe I have seen people apologize when an OP explained themselves better. I guess we are just people.
 

Kabeyun

Member
Silver
Jan 10, 2007
665
0
16
Northeast US
#11
once the bloom has worn off of the rose, traffic will slow down in this forum. But that minimzed traffic will have much more usable information.

Be patient - this too shall pass :)
Everyone's entitled to an opinion.

In light of the above, I presume we won't be seeing you too much until then. Feel free to post constructively if you do change your mind.

-K
 

prmdbr

New Member
Bronze
Jul 29, 2007
91
0
0
#12
Welcome to the concept of "fandom". It seems to be a more pronounced effect in the "techy/geek" communities surrounding technologies. You'll see the same effect in discussions about operating systems, peripheral devices (video cards, etc..) and to a lesser extent, in the automotive and motorcycling communities.

Marketing experts agree that once they have made the sale, the purchaser needs to feel that they indeed made a good decision to buy their product. This is why you'll see a lot of "reinforcement" type advertisments out there, primarily for automobiles. You see, when someone makes a large discretionary purchase, it is important for them to feel that they made a good decision.

Forums such as these are where like minded people (ostensibly have purchased an iPhone) can get together and compliment each other about how smart they were to make a decidedly luxury type purchase. $600 for a cellular phone (at it's roots) is equivalent of a person buying a Lexus or Benz in car parlance. With that much cash outlay, in discussions you can see from the threads here that any criticisms or complaints are generally swiftly discouraged. Think about it from a psychological standpoint - folks are probably catching grief as it is from their friends and family for buying a $600 phone. Even if some flaws are true (such as the inability to send MMS pictures through the device), to hear these flaws makes the person question their intelligence in purchasing the device.

Another effect seen in forums like this is pronounced obsessive tendencies. If a person is generally getting upset about say, a miniscule cosmetic defect on the iPhone, reality says that they are overreacting. Coming to a place like this and finding other like minded folks (who also obsess over minutia) calms their internal conflicts.

Forums such as this generally have much more "noise" than "signal", but through judicious searching and review you can generally find some helpful information between bloviating fanboys.

For me, I purchased my iPhone on "i-day" and while there are some surprises in functionality, for the most part I don't regret the purchase. But I take a more pragmatic approach - not obsessing over "is my screen a 5 or a 7" for instance. The poor folks at the Apple stores have got to be really getting a giggle out of the poor OCD laden purchasers searching for refunds and exchanges due to things like a 1/64th inch gap in the case that "is collecting some lint".

I saw the same effect when the PSP and iPod was released and once the bloom has worn off of the rose, traffic will slow down in this forum. But that minimzed traffic will have much more usable information.

Be patient - this too shall pass :)
Right on the nose. This was patently insightful.

:laugh2:
 

Tinman

Evangelist
Gold
Jul 16, 2007
4,334
183
63
Aridzona
#13
For those that wish to submit to idolotry and blindly worship the iPhone, then so, it is their prerogative. However, if someone is dissalusioned with the phone, its fit and features (or lack there of), they should be allowed to voice their pain without fear of being flamed by someone who probably hasn't even tried to understand the other person's point-of-view.
While there are indeed iPhone supporters here (ya' think?) I seriously doubt you wouldn't see a backlash on any product forum when you use terms such as "useless vanityware" to describe the product that the forum is centered on.

I don't agree with blind devotion, but that doesn't mean I'll agree with you either. I did my research, and knew exactly what I was and wasn't getting when I purchased an iPhone. While nothing is perfect, I have not been disappointed.

Finally, I wouldn't have held onto my iPhone if I "pretty much hated it." In my humble opinion that wouldn't make sense. Don't be shocked if people read that and wonder why you held onto yours.



--
Mike
 
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Hondamaker

Genius
Gold
May 14, 2007
9,922
662
113
55
Fairborn, Ohio
#14
I think one of the lesser-discussed topics is really how power users continue to be disappointed with the iPhone. It was never marketed as a power device, just a reliable all-in-one cell phone/web browser/media player. Sure, my Blackjack can do all of that and much more (and on a 3G network) but it doesn't do the things that it shares in common with the iPhone as well. And I don't have a need for those particular functions that would cause me to need a power device, but many others do. It's really more of a matter of people doing their homework before buying into the hype.

I'm sorry that you feel like the iPhone holds no value for you. Hopefully, there is a device out there for you that does.
It surprises me just how many 'power-users' and others who use their phone as a businesss tool are complaining, when it's been touted all along that the phone is not for businesss. Like Tinman said, I too looked at all the iPhone's features, new what I was getting before I got it, and am plenty happy with my purchase. This phone is pretty much an entertainment device, like Jobs said, it's a cell phone, an internet device and an ipod. It's like buying a car, knowing it doesn't have built-in GPS or XM stereo, and then complaining because it doesn't have built-in GPS or XM stereo!
 

crane98

New Member
Jul 11, 2007
121
0
0
#15
While there are indeed iPhone supporters here (ya' think?) I seriously doubt you wouldn't see a backlash on any product forum when you use terms such as "useless vanityware" to describe the product that the forum is centered on.

I don't agree with blind devotion, but that doesn't mean I'll agree with you either. I did my research, and knew exactly what I was and wasn't getting when I purchased an iPhone. While nothing is perfect, I have not been disappointed.

Finally, I wouldn't have held onto my iPhone if I "pretty much hated it." In my humble opinion that wouldn't make sense. Don't be shocked if people read that and wonder why you held onto yours.



--
Mike
So you KNOWINGLY paid $600 for a phone that doesn't have

picture messaging/receiving
voice recording
voice dialing
ringtones
video
aim
battery has to be sent to Apple
no cut and paste for browser

I was unaware of most of this, mainly because I never imagined they would release such an inferior product when it was suppose to be "revolutionary". I made a reasonable assumption. I would have never bought the phone in the first place if I had known it would be missing so many basic features. To me, if you knew all of this and still bought the phone, it was a pretty stupid thing to do.

And don't say that my decision was stupid because I didn't research my purchase. If you buy a new Mercedes, you're pretty much expecting that it comes with air conditioning and power seats. I never imagined a phone with so much hype would be missing these features. The phone is a piece of crap and I'm glad I finally sold mine.
 
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Tinman

Evangelist
Gold
Jul 16, 2007
4,334
183
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Aridzona
#16
So you KNOWINGLY paid $600 for a phone that doesn't have

picture messaging/receiving
voice recording
voice dialing
ringtones
video
aim
battery has to be sent to Apple
no cut and paste for browser

I was unaware of most of this, mainly because I never imagined they would release such an inferior product when it was suppose to be "revolutionary". I made a reasonable assumption. I would have never bought the phone in the first place if I had known it would be missing so many basic features. To me, if you knew all of this and still bought the phone, it was a pretty stupid thing to do.

And don't say that my decision was stupid because I didn't research my purchase. If you buy a new Mercedes, you're pretty much expecting that it comes with air conditioning and power seats. I never imagined a phone with so much hype would be missing these features. The phone is a piece of crap and I'm glad I finally sold mine.
OK, I won't say your decision was stupid.

Will you leave now?


--
Mike
 

prmdbr

New Member
Bronze
Jul 29, 2007
91
0
0
#17
Finally, I wouldn't have held onto my iPhone if I "pretty much hated it." In my humble opinion that wouldn't make sense. Don't be shocked if people read that and wonder why you held onto yours.



--
Mike
I didn't plan on hating the iPhone. I just didn't expect Apple to release the 1.0 with so many common features missing. I'm not talking about enterprise features either, I'm talking things like MMS and Cut and Paste.. things that most 14 year olds are doing on their 79 dollar LG phones.

As for holding on to the iPhone. It's here, but I'm currently back on my Treo 750.
 

Mactech

New Member
Bronze
Jun 28, 2007
79
0
0
#18
Oh yeah and...

I have to agree to a point, but what others may call "fanboys" I take offence to that. As tech for both platforms, I see and hear this everyday.

This device will be used for the corporate environment, just not yet. I support 4 iPhone users including myself. (So far) We don't have Blackberry’s and a handful of Treos. (Yuk). I read allot of whining on this board.

Do you have the right to? Yes... to a degree, because it really gets annoying and the trolling has been kept on a tight leash by the Admin (Kudos to Chris). I really enjoy the iPhone. It's not perfect however. I am not going to complain about it in a forum when I knew what to expect when purchasing the phone.

Buyer beware and all, constructive criticism is totally acceptable and needed to improve the device. Love this site, love the iPhone. :laugh2:
 

prmdbr

New Member
Bronze
Jul 29, 2007
91
0
0
#19
It's like buying a car, knowing it doesn't have built-in GPS or XM stereo, and then complaining because it doesn't have built-in GPS or XM stereo!
A more apt analogy would be: Buying a $110,000 luxury car and find that it's missing things like, ABS, heated seats, and MP3 integration. Things you'd expect to get for the money you paid.
 

Tinman

Evangelist
Gold
Jul 16, 2007
4,334
183
63
Aridzona
#20
I didn't plan on hating the iPhone. I just didn't expect Apple to release the 1.0 with so many common features missing. I'm not talking about enterprise features either, I'm talking things like MMS and Cut and Paste.. things that most 14 year olds are doing their 79 dollar LG phones.

As for holding on to the iPhone. It's here, but I'm currently back on my Treo 750.
I knew the iPhone didn't have MMS and c&p before I ever looked at one in person. It was mentioned in every review I read--and elsewhere.

I came from a Treo and at this point have trouble even looking at it. Yes, there are things I could do with my Treo that I cannot with my iPhone. But before buying my iPhone I tallied up these functions and came to the conclusion I rarely used them. Editing Office docs, for instance: I realized I used that feature a whopping 2 times with my Treo (usually just viewed them). One of those times I couldn't actually edit anything anyway--Docs2Go crashed no matter what I did, and this could not be fixed till I got back to my PC to reinstall it. But I digress...

In any event you are free to use whatever device works best for you. But you need to understand that just because the iPhone doesn't work for you, it doesn't make the iphone--in the hands of those for whom it does work--"useless vanityware."


--
Mike
 
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