AT&T, why are you doing this to me?

Europa

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Wow, 50-80 GB/month?! You have the highest mobile data usage that I have ever heard of. I thought 25 GB/month was a lot. In three+ years, I've never exceeded 1 GB/month and I'm not even trying to keep it low; I just have WiFi access in so many places.
 

fury

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Oct 23, 2007
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To be fair, I am paying considerably anyway. It's not like I'm trying to squeeze by with the bare minimum $70 + tax (minutes + unlimited data) and still clog up the intertubes. I pay somewhere in the range of $110-220 a month depending on how many lines I have active, which of them have data on them (phone testing, using upgrades and whatnot), etc. So, maybe they look at that and say "eh, that's close enough" and move along to the next guy.
 

Europa

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I think it's pretty safe to say that you're in the top 1%. I'm surprised they are letting it slide. Kyle said he hasn't received the text, either. He uses around 25 GB/month, I think.
 

Tinman

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I guess I am one of those round pegs. I live in the future before the future is ready. I just hope it doesn't cause a temporal implosion when it catches up with me.
Sounds more like a place not well-covered in WiFi yet.

I think there is a misconception going on here by some of those in the top 2% or higher of mobile data users: that the mobile networks are robust so why not dive right in and use them full-tilt. The reality is as of right now there is NO chance that the mobile data networks in this country could handle everyone using the kind of data they are using right now.

It's like a supply of drinking water (3G) for a community: there may be more than enough for everyone to drink as long as they all bathed in the lake (Wifi) instead. Now if a few people decide they'd rather or perhaps claim need to bathe with drinking water it would not cause water shortages. But as this community is growing there would soon be a problem letting people use more water than what is considered reasonable. So the community starts turning the water off, or rather turns it down to a slow trickle, for anyone using so much water.

AT&T has done something similar.

This will not change until there is a heck of a lot more capacity and spectrum available for mobile data. And a whole chunk of cash to make it happen.

Michael
 
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fury

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It's like a supply of drinking water
Not really. Water is a finite element. You cannot make more of it. And data doesn't return to its source after you're done "using" it.

It's a queue, a flow. A little more like traffic, where you can get into a jam when too many people are on, or when one or two people up in front are a little slow and there's no way around them, or when the roads aren't designed well enough. But it is also somewhat unlike the traffic system in one key way: infinitely* more roads can be created to handle the load. AT&T's just slow at upgrading their highways in key places, and in the mean time has decided you can only drive for 30 minutes a day unless you want to pay a higher toll, or get restricted to the slower roads to stay out of the way. And from that perspective, it makes sense for them to do what they need to do to manage the construction traffic (throttle, tier, etc.), but it doesn't make the people who drive for 6 hours a day bad people. They might be doing their job, they might be driving for fun, they might be just getting from point A to point B.

*: yes, I know there is only so much physical space that can exist for a new tower to be put up, and there is only so much spectrum for a certain type of radio signal to span, and only so many distinct devices that can share in a single tower. I mean in a big picture way, like new technologies or new ways to use that spectrum more efficiently, like the move from analog TV to digital.

Nobody complains about or blames the people that have to use that road to get to work or home or go do what they do. They complain about the construction traffic and blame the city that's slow to move it along. But somehow, in the mobile broadband space, people who use it like they mean it get blamed for why it's so bad, and I just don't think that is completely fair.

I look forward to the day when we're swimming in LTE and these limited data plans and one lane highways are a thing of the past.

Oh, yeah...

And a whole chunk of cash to make it happen.
Like the $40 billion they're trying to spend on T-mobile
 

Tinman

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Not really. Water is a finite element. You cannot make more of it. And data doesn't return to its source after you're done "using" it.

It's a queue, a flow. A little more like traffic, where you can get into a jam when too many people are on, or when one or two people up in front are a little slow and there's no way around them, or when the roads aren't designed well enough. But it is also somewhat unlike the traffic system in one key way: infinitely* more roads can be created to handle the load. AT&T's just slow at upgrading their highways in key places, and in the mean time has decided you can only drive for 30 minutes a day unless you want to pay a higher toll, or get restricted to the slower roads to stay out of the way. And from that perspective, it makes sense for them to do what they need to do to manage the construction traffic (throttle, tier, etc.), but it doesn't make the people who drive for 6 hours a day bad people. They might be doing their job, they might be driving for fun, they might be just getting from point A to point B.

*: yes, I know there is only so much physical space that can exist for a new tower to be put up, and there is only so much spectrum for a certain type of radio signal to span, and only so many distinct devices that can share in a single tower. I mean in a big picture way, like new technologies or new ways to use that spectrum more efficiently, like the move from analog TV to digital.

Nobody complains about or blames the people that have to use that road to get to work or home or go do what they do. They complain about the construction traffic and blame the city that's slow to move it along. But somehow, in the mobile broadband space, people who use it like they mean it get blamed for why it's so bad, and I just don't think that is completely fair.

I look forward to the day when we're swimming in LTE and these limited data plans and one lane highways are a thing of the past.
Seems as if you are justifying your usage without ever acknowledging that if we all did that the system would come to a crashing halt. Is it really that hard to admit the fact you are taking more than what most would consider reasonable? You are in the extreme minority of data users.

Oh, yeah...

Like the $40 billion they're trying to spend on T-mobile
Not even a drop in the bucket to allow all of us to use as much data as you do. And for what? They would have to raise prices astronomically to accommodate all of us at your usage levels, when the majority of us don't need it or want to pay for it. I say let that those who use the most pay the most--and not $5 extra per month.

If my neighbor uses twice as much water, gas, or electrictity than I do they don't pay what I pay: they pay double. You use at least 25x more data than the average iPhone user but do not pay 25x more. If you don't mind paying $500+ per month for mobile data then I say, fine, we are on the same page.
`

Michael
 

fury

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Seems as if you are justifying your usage without ever acknowledging that if we all did that the system would come to crashing halt. Is it really that hard to admit that the fact you are taking more than what most would consider reasonable?
If we all drove 6 hours a day, most roads would slow to a crawl. But funnily enough, most people don't need to at the same time, so it works out. I think if most people would not consider what I do reasonable, then their definition of reasonable is wrong, perhaps a little too heavily influenced by the propaganda by the carriers. I am not sitting here downloading files all day like a pirate stealing loot for the sake of greed. I used to tether, and I'm glad I don't need to now as I didn't like having to do it and feeling like I was at the mercy of a sleeping giant that might disconnect me. I am just living in the information age that AT&T once so proudly boasted that they would bring. "Have you ever...? You will. And the company that will bring it to you? AT&T". They're just having a few growing pains along the way.

Not even a drop in the bucket to allow all of us to use as much data as you do. And for what? They would have to raise prices astronomically to accommodate all of us at your usage levels, when the majority of us don't need it or want to pay for it. I say let that those who use the most pay the most--and not $5 extra per month.

If my neighbor uses twice as much water, gas, or electrictity than I do they don't pay what I pay: they pay double. You use at least 25x more data than the average iPhone user but do not pay 25x more. If you don't mind paying $500+ per month for mobile data then I say, fine, we are on the same page.
`

Michael
Again, finite elements. You can make the argument that me using 25 gallons of water per minute costs the water company (and thus me) 25 times more to deliver than 1 gallon per minute, and I will happily pay that difference. That does not mean that me using a gig or two a day to get my information costs the phone company 25 times more to deliver it to me than to deliver to someone who takes a month to get that much. There are more forces at work and more variables than a measurable quantity of bits, so no, we are not on the same page. :)

edit: since water is obviously the topic here, and not data, let me share an example on that note. I live in an apartment for which water is included in the rent. The policy is that unreasonable water usage is grounds for a fee, and they recommend that I avoid leaving the taps on and check for leaks but otherwise do not monitor or bother me about it. I take long showers, and I am anal about washing my dishes and clothes thoroughly, sometimes twice. So far, they have not found my water usage to be unreasonable, so I continue to do what I do. AT&T has yet to tell me (personally) that what I'm doing is unreasonable.

edit 2: you know, on second thought, life's too short to ***** on an internet forum. I'm clearly on the "wrong" side of this one and that's how it will remain.
 

Tinman

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If we all drove 6 hours a day, most roads would slow to a crawl. But funnily enough, most people don't need to at the same time, so it works out. I think if most people would not consider what I do reasonable, then their definition of reasonable is wrong, perhaps a little too heavily influenced by the propaganda by the carriers. I am not sitting here downloading files all day like a pirate stealing loot for the sake of greed. I used to tether, and I'm glad I don't need to now as I didn't like having to do it and feeling like I was at the mercy of a sleeping giant that might disconnect me. I am just living in the information age that AT&T once so proudly boasted that they would bring. "Have you ever...? You will. And the company that will bring it to you? AT&T". They're just having a few growing pains along the way.

Again, finite elements. You can make the argument that me using 25 gallons of water per minute costs the water company (and thus me) 25 times more to deliver than 1 gallon per minute, and I will happily pay that difference. That does not mean that me using a gig or two a day to get my information costs the phone company 25 times more to deliver it to me than to deliver to someone who takes a month to get that much. There are more forces at work and more variables than a measurable quantity of bits, so no, we are not on the same page. :)

edit: since water is obviously the topic here, and not data, let me share an example on that note. I live in an apartment for which water is included in the rent. The policy is that unreasonable water usage is grounds for a fee, and they recommend that I avoid leaving the taps on and check for leaks but otherwise do not monitor or bother me about it. I take long showers, and I am anal about washing my dishes and clothes thoroughly, sometimes twice. So far, they have not found my water usage to be unreasonable, so I continue to do what I do. AT&T has yet to tell me (personally) that what I'm doing is unreasonable.

edit 2: you know, on second thought, life's too short to ***** on an internet forum. I'm clearly on the "wrong" side of this one and that's how it will remain.
Hey! It's OK... this is not b1thcing :). You are presenting your points very well. I may not agree but what would be the fun if we all agreed?

Michael
 

bballrob

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They will give you multiple notices before they throttle you, ben, if you haven't received a warning you're not being slowed down. I have not received a throttle message yet. Anyone else use data like this with no warning messages yet?
Wow. I'm just Over 8 gigs on day 18. No throttle messaggez yet.
 

bballrob

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He's the type of people that improves the system. He uses so much it might make AT&T add a bigger infrastructure to that tower. No pain no game. Maybe he lives in nowhere so it doesn't really clog up the tower?
I think I live in one of these areas.

I'm also one of those that started streaming more to spite ATT when the Announced throttling plans.
 

bballrob

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I use about 40-50 gigs a month. I am probably going to be one of the first to get smacked with the throttling, just waiting anxiously to get that text that I'm a data hog and they're coming to take me away... I did tether for a few months as my only internet connection (when I moved, before I settled on a land line connection) and my data usage was a bit higher initially - 60-80 gigs a month. I never got any flack from AT&T about it, nor have I heard a peep about my consistently high data usage (exclusively on the phone) since. I am unsure if Louisville, KY is a problem area for them or not, or if they are excusing me for paying them so much money.

I have been perfectly satisfied with AT&T's product - the cell coverage and the data speeds are just mind boggling compared to my old carrier Verizon and the brief spell I had with Sprint some years ago. I have also been satisfied with AT&T's service. Their phone representatives have always been courteous, helpful, and effective to me. And in the past, I was satisfied with AT&T's policies. Then when they changed, at least they seemed to make sense. I understand they have had to switch to tiered pricing for data in order to keep up with the increasing data demand. I'm not going to fault them for that. I will have to see how it goes--whether I get throttled or not, and by how much. If the throttling is down to scaling me back to Sprint or Verizon like speeds, then that's no big deal and I'll live with that. If it's back to EDGE land, I might have cause to hop over to Sprint.

I don't like the idea of people being lumped in with a generalized category of "stick it to the man" rebels who are using data just to spite AT&T though. That's calling a lot of people childish whereas they might have legitimate on-the-go data needs. I am probably one of the most extreme examples. Sure, I use a lot of data... I soak up a lot of information--legitimately. On-the-go, as true to the word "mobile" as I can think of being. There are many circumstances at play. I listen to/watch a lot of podcasts. Guessing about 40-60 hours a week of podcasts (counting playing them back at 1.5-2x speed sometimes) and about 3/4 of them are video. I can't use my work connection to do it (for one thing, policy, and for another, too slow). I'm not at home long enough to do much of my downloading--AT&T's DSL is paltry in my area. I get maybe 2 or 3 downloads done at home, usually big app updates. I can't justify the expense of a faster connection at home for faster downloading for just the few hours I spend there. I never listened or watched on the computer so it didn't make sense to download from the computer just to move them over to my phone. I don't have the space on my computer anyway. And so on and so forth.

I guess I am one of those round pegs. I live in the future before the future is ready. I just hope it doesn't cause a temporal implosion when it catches up with me.
Back in your tethering days, which app did u use?
 

GoalieEd

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.....I've seen screenshots on this forum of data usage in excess of 25 GB. Theses are the people they are targeting, not those who use 2 or 3 GB......
I saw this post a few months ago, and I'm now getting notices at 2.08 GB. Thanks AT&T.


Sent from my iPad using iCafe app
 

Europa

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$36 upgrade fees, jeez! What does this upgrade fee do?! Do the people in the store have to push more buttons to upgrade a phone?
I thought it was $18. Either way, it's pretty easy to get them to waive it if your account is in good standing. I've always been able to.