GPS Software?
- Thread starter ihomer
- Start date
Well software definitely not because GPS is hardware.. possibly in near future newer iPhone models yes but not this version
I think GPS-like features could be added. Even if true GPS is not in the phone, all phones must report location during emergency calls, even if that invovles tower triangulation. I would think the OS could somehow gather that data and translate to maps or other apps if needed.
Well that's me hoping at least.
Well that's me hoping at least.
I read somewhere that Cingular, er, ATT keeps a strangehold on their GPS and that only companies like Sprint release it to be used in an application on the handset. But then, ATT was doing a lot of things differently before the iPhone came along...I think GPS-like features could be added. Even if true GPS is not in the phone, all phones must report location during emergency calls, even if that invovles tower triangulation. I would think the OS could somehow gather that data and translate to maps or other apps if needed.
Well that's me hoping at least.
Maybe they will get it to work with an external GPS device. I've got a bluetooth one that came with microsoft streets and trips. That would be cool if google maps app could work with it.
That's not true at all. All you need is a bluetooth GPS receiver and Apple to turn on bluetooth serial device support on the iPhone.
Many, many phones work this way (in fact, the last 4 phones I've owned worked GREAT with an external bluetooth GPS receiver).
My Samsung BlackJack used an external bluetooth GPS device. The iPhone must have that capability
I don't think att will allow internal software to be used unless someone finds a rare hack, however... Like most phones, it can probably operate on Bluetooth gps
It does have bluetooth but Apple has limited it so far. It will work with headsets and other devices of that kind but they have not enabled bluetooth serial device support - which is what external bluetooth GPS devices use.
Why not support external GPS
This is one of the small things which bugs me most - we have Bluetooth 2 EDR on iPhone but it only supports headsets! Come on no data transfer, no serial support, no GPS support etc.... Might have well not included BT or left it at v1.x. This is probably not driven by Apple but ATT - on Blackberry 8800 (built in GPS) ATT have crippled the GPS - you have to buy NavTech subscription from them to use GPS - Blackberry maps (a free GPS aware program) is and will not install on the device (without tweaks), Goggle maps (another free program Blackberry program, same the one as on iPhone, is also GPS blocked, it is available on non-ATT devices with full GPS support) - why? They want to sell you the service. Expect it to come as a ATT option for a cost (~$10 per month currently on Blackberry 8800) soon. On T-Mobile etc. you can use Blackberry/Goggle maps and external GPS, with no issues or cost (in fact it works well). Even on the Blackberry Pearl you can use these programs with an external BT GPS unit. It is not a major technical issue to add this BT support it is a commercial decision driven by ATT. I am feed up with hearing you can't do this (add programs etc.) due to security issues - just look at Blackberry's and WM5/6 PDA/Smartphones - how many external programs can you install on these - they are just limited by the available memory. Don't get me wrong I like the iPhone but unless these things change it will remain a select market device - people want more than just the current functionality (in fact certain items, like the stock widget are useless in my mind, give me the ability to store encrypted passwords and I'd jump at it in preference
)
This is one of the small things which bugs me most - we have Bluetooth 2 EDR on iPhone but it only supports headsets! Come on no data transfer, no serial support, no GPS support etc.... Might have well not included BT or left it at v1.x. This is probably not driven by Apple but ATT - on Blackberry 8800 (built in GPS) ATT have crippled the GPS - you have to buy NavTech subscription from them to use GPS - Blackberry maps (a free GPS aware program) is and will not install on the device (without tweaks), Goggle maps (another free program Blackberry program, same the one as on iPhone, is also GPS blocked, it is available on non-ATT devices with full GPS support) - why? They want to sell you the service. Expect it to come as a ATT option for a cost (~$10 per month currently on Blackberry 8800) soon. On T-Mobile etc. you can use Blackberry/Goggle maps and external GPS, with no issues or cost (in fact it works well). Even on the Blackberry Pearl you can use these programs with an external BT GPS unit. It is not a major technical issue to add this BT support it is a commercial decision driven by ATT. I am feed up with hearing you can't do this (add programs etc.) due to security issues - just look at Blackberry's and WM5/6 PDA/Smartphones - how many external programs can you install on these - they are just limited by the available memory. Don't get me wrong I like the iPhone but unless these things change it will remain a select market device - people want more than just the current functionality (in fact certain items, like the stock widget are useless in my mind, give me the ability to store encrypted passwords and I'd jump at it in preference
)If (when) they turn it on, there's nothing stopping anyone from coming out with a cool turn-by-turn GPS app online and "get around" Apple's lock on app development & licensing. If I'm Apple, I want to create (or license someone to create - like Garmin who announced in January that they were writing OS X GPS software) to make an iphone-based GPS app and sell it with a BT GPS receiver before opening the door to anyone else. I don't blame them. In fact, I look forward to what Apple could do with the UI on a GPS app.
That is exactly my thinking.
In fact TeleNav already has this for other phones but i think is app based not web based. They even sell GPS for the other phones. I sent an inquiry about them delevoping something for the iPhone but never got a response.
http://www.telenav.com/
Actually
All the current version of these GPS applications are apps based - they only use the web to download and update the current map or route. Basically they go to the web download a limited map and then go back to the web to update this once your move out of the current downloaded area. They cannot tell whether you are just requesting the map or are actually at that location unless you tell them to find current location. To do this purely via the web will require the phone to send your GPS data continuously to the web-page application - that adds potential security issues - they must do it this way otherwise when you go out of coverage (you can lose web contact for limit periods and still see map, tested this on Blackberry with Goggle Maps, BB maps and Wayfinder 7) . Now both the applications vendor and the phone company would know your current location.
All the current version of these GPS applications are apps based - they only use the web to download and update the current map or route. Basically they go to the web download a limited map and then go back to the web to update this once your move out of the current downloaded area. They cannot tell whether you are just requesting the map or are actually at that location unless you tell them to find current location. To do this purely via the web will require the phone to send your GPS data continuously to the web-page application - that adds potential security issues - they must do it this way otherwise when you go out of coverage (you can lose web contact for limit periods and still see map, tested this on Blackberry with Goggle Maps, BB maps and Wayfinder 7) . Now both the applications vendor and the phone company would know your current location.
Many of you who are impatient and upset about the iPhones current limitations my be first time "early adopters". As a total gadget freak, I have a lot of experience in owning the "latest and greatest" devices and waiting for their refinements. I have in my mind a wish list of things that I would like to see happen with the iPhone, Exchange push, GPS abilities, and Ebooks are among my top three. Frankly, this is the first device that I bought at release that at least had some accessories. I think I've always had to wait for cases, car chargers and so forth. Of course it didn't hurt the so many iPod accessories were already compatible with it.
I think that it's going to be important to excersise some patience with Apple and let them do what they usually do best. Doing it RIGHT. The iPhone is in it's infancy right now. That is a fact of life and one that you'll have to accept in order to be at peace with it. You could run out and get the latest Windows Mobile device and have everything you want with an excess of third party software to boot. The problem is, with most Windows based devices, is that they are "jacks of all trades and masters of none". The slew of third party apps written by a vast number of different companies generally will add functionability to the device, but often serve to slow it down and make it unstable. (Much like the Windows PC)
I speak from years of experience as an Operations/IT manager that has used nearly every conceivable smartphone device when I say that a slew of 3rd party apps can be a very bad experience on your mobile device. The first rule of thumb when those devices become unstable is to uninstall all the 3rd party stuff one at a time to identify the culprit. Your program "X" may run great on your device, but not with program "Y" installed and so on.
Back on point though, I've used many devices over the years and had to wait for nearly every "option" that people take for granted nowadays. Push mail, BT, Stereo Bluetooth, GPRS to EDGE to UTMS to HSDPA, etc. As an early adopter, this is the price you pay. If the waiting is going to drive you nuts, it might be a good idea to swap the iPhone for something a little more seasoned that has it all "now". I'm sure in time, the iPhone will have caught up and knowing Apple, surpased the competitors and then you'll have a device you can enjoy to the fullest.
Knowing Apple, they have reasons for EVERYTHING they included and excluded in this device. Many of the advance features of the WM devices require true "tech geeks" and hours and hours of time to tweek them into something stable and usable. This device works out of the box. It's easy to use and easy to understand. This device was designed for the masses, not the elite "power users". Features will be added on but Apple will try to ensure that what goes on the iPhone follows suit with the rest of the applications; well thought out, stable, easy to use and understand, and with the usual style and elegance of Apple software.
Wow. I have rambled on. Anyway, I'm excited by this device and it's potential. As new as it is, I'm already seeing some really nice stuff in the works for it. I think it was only just over a week after the iPhone release that JiveTalk release a very nice chat program for the device. It's not perfect but it is an Alpha release.
If you have the patience, stick with it. I think you'll be delighted with even more as time goes on. If not, Ebay it or return it and try something else. There are other good devices out there that may better suit your needs and lifestyle.
I think that it's going to be important to excersise some patience with Apple and let them do what they usually do best. Doing it RIGHT. The iPhone is in it's infancy right now. That is a fact of life and one that you'll have to accept in order to be at peace with it. You could run out and get the latest Windows Mobile device and have everything you want with an excess of third party software to boot. The problem is, with most Windows based devices, is that they are "jacks of all trades and masters of none". The slew of third party apps written by a vast number of different companies generally will add functionability to the device, but often serve to slow it down and make it unstable. (Much like the Windows PC)
I speak from years of experience as an Operations/IT manager that has used nearly every conceivable smartphone device when I say that a slew of 3rd party apps can be a very bad experience on your mobile device. The first rule of thumb when those devices become unstable is to uninstall all the 3rd party stuff one at a time to identify the culprit. Your program "X" may run great on your device, but not with program "Y" installed and so on.
Back on point though, I've used many devices over the years and had to wait for nearly every "option" that people take for granted nowadays. Push mail, BT, Stereo Bluetooth, GPRS to EDGE to UTMS to HSDPA, etc. As an early adopter, this is the price you pay. If the waiting is going to drive you nuts, it might be a good idea to swap the iPhone for something a little more seasoned that has it all "now". I'm sure in time, the iPhone will have caught up and knowing Apple, surpased the competitors and then you'll have a device you can enjoy to the fullest.
Knowing Apple, they have reasons for EVERYTHING they included and excluded in this device. Many of the advance features of the WM devices require true "tech geeks" and hours and hours of time to tweek them into something stable and usable. This device works out of the box. It's easy to use and easy to understand. This device was designed for the masses, not the elite "power users". Features will be added on but Apple will try to ensure that what goes on the iPhone follows suit with the rest of the applications; well thought out, stable, easy to use and understand, and with the usual style and elegance of Apple software.
Wow. I have rambled on. Anyway, I'm excited by this device and it's potential. As new as it is, I'm already seeing some really nice stuff in the works for it. I think it was only just over a week after the iPhone release that JiveTalk release a very nice chat program for the device. It's not perfect but it is an Alpha release.
If you have the patience, stick with it. I think you'll be delighted with even more as time goes on. If not, Ebay it or return it and try something else. There are other good devices out there that may better suit your needs and lifestyle.
Sorry
Sorry but I disagree they have clearly missed some of the basics - one of which is BT support - the iPhone is a BT capable (its a BT iPod) without a BT stereo headset profile - it has a mapping program which is next to useless without a BT GPS profile/capability (you use these to navigate, often in a car so it must prompt you with directions not expect you to watch a screen, that is clearly an accident waiting to happen) - they've put a BT 2.0 EDR unit in it without supporting file transfer (someone out there has already generated a program for file transfer for Mac, all be it via the 30 pin connector, so its not rocket science). There is no real reason why these should have been missed on the first round of software. None of these would require 3rd party software or great programming capability or impact the device functionality (other than maybe battery life) - None of these is new technology. Lets be honest the iPhone is really only a PDA phone and iPod fused in to one unit with a great screen and interface so most of the stuff has already been debugged
Sorry but I disagree they have clearly missed some of the basics - one of which is BT support - the iPhone is a BT capable (its a BT iPod) without a BT stereo headset profile - it has a mapping program which is next to useless without a BT GPS profile/capability (you use these to navigate, often in a car so it must prompt you with directions not expect you to watch a screen, that is clearly an accident waiting to happen) - they've put a BT 2.0 EDR unit in it without supporting file transfer (someone out there has already generated a program for file transfer for Mac, all be it via the 30 pin connector, so its not rocket science). There is no real reason why these should have been missed on the first round of software. None of these would require 3rd party software or great programming capability or impact the device functionality (other than maybe battery life) - None of these is new technology. Lets be honest the iPhone is really only a PDA phone and iPod fused in to one unit with a great screen and interface so most of the stuff has already been debugged
Maybe I'm missing something but I have used Google Maps with a BT GPS device and frankly it's all but useless as a GPS device. Even with GPS it does not give you voice prompted turn by turn directions so you'd still be looking at the screen for direction prompts. And the maps do not refresh fast enough to be of any use while driving. Google Maps may one day be a true GPS program but it's not there yet. In fairness to Apple, they did NOT tout the iPhone or Google Maps as a GPS solution so I don't see how they can be faulted for that. Google Maps does what it is supposed to. Nothing more.
Also, there may be a very good reason why this version of Google Maps is not BT enabled. Apple is likely working on it's own GPS software application.
I understand the nature of your complaints but you are upset at the iPhone not being what it never claimed to be. A GPS device for one. The limitations of this device, the BT transfer, BT stereo, etc., were published before the device was released so you either didn't read enough about it or ingnored it and bought it anyway so you could gripe about it later. Or maybe you believed all the "rumor mill" blogs that said it was going to be capable of "this and that" with no proof to back it up.
So far as I've seen, it does everything that Apple said it would do. For anything beyond that you really only have two choices. Return it and get something that better suits your needs or just wait and see what future programs and updates bring. It really sounds like you'd be happier with more of a PocketPC device.
I'm not trying to start an argument or flame war here. I'm simply pointing out FACTS that no matter what they "could" have done, or "should" have done; Apple did what they said it WOULD do.
Also, there may be a very good reason why this version of Google Maps is not BT enabled. Apple is likely working on it's own GPS software application.
I understand the nature of your complaints but you are upset at the iPhone not being what it never claimed to be. A GPS device for one. The limitations of this device, the BT transfer, BT stereo, etc., were published before the device was released so you either didn't read enough about it or ingnored it and bought it anyway so you could gripe about it later. Or maybe you believed all the "rumor mill" blogs that said it was going to be capable of "this and that" with no proof to back it up.
So far as I've seen, it does everything that Apple said it would do. For anything beyond that you really only have two choices. Return it and get something that better suits your needs or just wait and see what future programs and updates bring. It really sounds like you'd be happier with more of a PocketPC device.
I'm not trying to start an argument or flame war here. I'm simply pointing out FACTS that no matter what they "could" have done, or "should" have done; Apple did what they said it WOULD do.
